Slip Sliding Away - Paul Simon

[Buckrub]

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/06/17/19003391-supreme-court-strikes-down-arizona-law-requiring-proof-of-citizenship-to-vote?lite

[quercus alba]

I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but anyone that can't see our crabgrass government infringing more and more on our lives is both blind and deluded. Freedom ain't what it used to be.

[Buckrub]

When you don't have to prove you're an American Citizen to vote for an American Officeholder, then I just think I give up.

The people lauding this the most, are not citizens. What does that say?

Did I miss a memo somewhere back there, or something?

[Buckrub]

Here's some of the logic of the arguments that won:

“It’s extremely inadequate,” Horne said. “It’s essentially an honor system. It does not do the job.”

“Well,” answered Justice Sonia Sotomayor, “that’s what the federal system decided was enough.”

The court’s conservatives appeared sympathetic to the Arizona side. Scalia said that federal law clearly empowers the states to take additional action to assess a potential voter’s eligibility.

“Under oath is not proof at all,” he said. “It’s just a statement.”

Patricia Millett, a lawyer for groups opposed to the law, countered: “Statements under oath in a criminal case are proof beyond a reasonable doubt” in criminal cases that result in execution.

“It’s a very serious oath,” she said.

__________________________

I wonder if it's as serious as "I swear to uphold, defend, and protect the Constitution of the United States of America"???

[Buckrub]

I just thought of this. I remember the El Salvadorans that painted my house a couple of years ago, proudly showing me their new Arkansas Drivers license. Their entire families were here. None were Citizens, and none had any desire to be.

That drivers license is all that is required to vote.

[BarryBobPosthole]

That, and having your name on the list at the polls. At least where I vote that's required. I'm not sure what requiring IDs at the polls does for improving voter fraud. Nor am I even sure that voter fraud occurs in a big enough way to determine outcomes of elections. We've got a lot bigger fish to fry. Besides, this affects Arizona, not Oklahoma. what does it matter.....(a Three Dog Night pun....)

BKB

[Thumper]

I was kinda wondering the same thing. Seems like a lot of hoopla over nothing. When election time comes around, I get a letter telling me what voting station I've been assigned (comes with my voter registration card). When I arrive, they check my name against the voter rolls for that particular voting station. If I'm not on the list, I don't vote. While I was in line at the last election, an elderly gentleman got to the desk, he wasn't on the rolls and once they found out where he lived, directed him to the correct voting station that was about 2 miles away. I'm not sure of the total procedure, but I don't think just anyone can simply walk up to a polling place and vote. Heck, I've never had to prove I'm a citizen either ... I could be European for all anybody knows. I think most of this is simply ammunition for someone to blow out of proportion.

[Buckrub]

I'm not sure there are enough murders to really justify having that law on the books either.

The issue is 'doing the right thing'. It isn't solving a big problem that exists, it's ensuring that one doesn't happen.

There is only one reason I can see to oppose it. Only one.

[Thumper]

Not sure what flashing an ID proves. Heck, when I was in college, I made my side money as a "boot-legger". (the university was in a dry county) The drinking age was 21 ... I was 18 ... but I had a "driver's license" for both Tennessee and Kentucky showing I was of age ... and that was in the days before computers/printers and easy-peasy fake ID mills. ;)

[Buckrub]

Your arguments are "I don't have any trouble voting, so why bother asking all voters to prove they're citizens??"

Further, you claim to have cheated the laws for drinking with a fake ID. I'm sure you did. The El Salvadorans are cheating the voting system by having a VALID ID, the only one required if you register to vote. And you don't seem to care. Which is the one reason that I mentioned.

And if one illegal alien votes, then to you, and Posthole, that's not a big deal so who cares?

And what does flashing an ID prove? That you are a citizen and can legally vote. What else would it prove? You have no compunction to flash it to fly a private airplane, but not to vote.

Blows me away.

[Trav]

Barry, Jimbo the issue is a lot of states don't use the voter roles like Oklahoma and Florida. I think in some states you can just show up and vote.

[Buckrub]

http://www.ncsl.org/legislatures-elections/elections/voter-id.aspx#State_Reqs

If I'm not color blind, that's 22 states with NO voter ID law whatsoever.

[BarryBobPosthole]

I haven't had anyone tell me that illegal aliens are actually voting in Oklahoma is my only point, and I have no idea how they even could. Nor do I see how requiring them to show a drivers license would prevent it if it was happening.

So it doesn't matter much to me one way or the other.

and I think I had to show my drivers license when I last voted.

BKB

[Buckrub]

Now you have.

Illegal aliens are voting in Oklahoma.

But they are DANG sure voting in 22 states.

[BarryBobPosthole]

They must be some mighty staunch republicans then because that's the only party that's won anything here in Oklahoma in a good long while.

BKB

[Buckrub]

They should be.

But they aren't. They vote with you. :headbang

[LJ3]

I don't think ID is good enough. Proof of citizenship should be required. Voting in an election in the United States should be a right available only to legal citizens of the country. How anyone could possibly argue against that, not that any of you are, is just silliness.

[Buckrub]

Thank you, sir.

I cannot add to what you said.

[Captain]

Ditto Len!!!

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

[Thumper]

I don't think ID is good enough. Proof of citizenship should be required. Voting in an election in the United States should be a right available only to legal citizens of the country. How anyone could possibly argue against that, not that any of you are, is just silliness.

I got's ta' roll with that one Lenster. It's been so long since I registered, I don't even know what ID I had to show, but I believe it was simply my driver's license. I hate to admit it, but I'm not even sure what the process is to verify citizenship for voter registration where I first registered or if there is any verification at all (I'm sure I could look it up). Heck, I had to prove citizenship (birth cert) to apply for my CCW ... I have no idea why I shouldn't have to do the same to vote.

That said, I'm sure if driver's licenses and Social Security cards are forged these days ... a voter registration card would be easy-peasy. I just don't think many "illegals" would go to the trouble and effort to obtain a bogus card, then risk getting caught somehow by showing up at the polls. I'd think they'd want to keep a low profile. Heck, it's hard enough to get LEGAL citizens to vote. How any state allows any Tom, Dick & Harry to simply walk in and vote baffles me. Surely it's not that easy is it?

[Buckrub]

Jim, you aren't reading well.

I said I personally, first hand, know illegal aliens that got a VALID (not bogus, not illegal) drivers license. They use that to vote, because that is all that is required here. In 22 other states NOTHING is required.

I don't even understand, like Len, how this can even be validly opposed by anyone, including the SCOTUS.