Oh the Irony

[Buckrub]

Post hole is having to watch the end of his OU game on Fox News Channel. .......

[LW]

Be positive. We need the good karma tonight.

[BarryBobPosthole]

Bell has the touch of a prison inmate on a conjugal visit.

Still a victory is a victory.

Now its on to important shit. The Cards need the bottom of the order to pitch in if they're gonna make this work.

BKB

[Buckrub]

I've been to three goat roping and nine county fairs and I've never seen anything like that.

Worse we'll be playing with 24 rest of the way.

They should have killed Workman and didn't.

[LW]

I'm just thankful for a win.

[Buckrub]

Ok. I'm wearing my Descalso jersey.

But Lynn has to be trade bait. Head cases don't fit here.

[Buckrub]

However he should a stayed in one more batter.

;)

[Buckrub]

My great day.

OK, after watching over 145 games this year, my EXPERT opinion is........just about the only way we're gonna pull this out is to win the next two 3-2 and 1-0. I don't see much other hope, although Kelly has been good.

It's a good series. Lots of storylines. Some that shouldn't be, but they are. But Wong and Lynn just became trade bait!! Can't have that. Won't play Cruz, and Kozma can't hit his hat size (neither can Descalso but he seems to get a free ride on that). Series hopes rest on shoulders of 7 guys. First five batters in the order and Wano and WachaWacha.

[Captain]

OK, after watching over 145 games this year,

That statement is crying for me to call BS on..... No way you have watched 145 + games of baseball this year...

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

[Buckrub]

You're probably right.

Upon reflection, I'd say more like 155. I do think I missed about 10 games for some reason. 162 regular season, plus playoffs (which I sure ain't missed. I take my TV with me now!!! :))

[BarryBobPosthole]

Why isn't Kolten Wong on your trade list? Although, I'm not sure who would have him.

And we wouldn't even be in the World Series without Daniel Descalso. As for Kozma, I think if his defense gets better we can put up with his poor offense. And who's to say that won't pick up? Yadi wasn't all that good offensively for many years. Not that's he's on the same level as Yadi.

This game tonight is the biggest game yet. I think we'll win big. The tank is almost empty on Red Sox pitching. We've seen what they've got and its time for the offense to shine. Whoever wins tonight will have a huge advantage the rest of the way as the other team has to win out.

BKB

BKB

[DeputyDog]

Yeah, but Boston will have to win out at home.

[BarryBobPosthole]

As even as these teams are, I think a split at Boston is very likely. that's why I like the Card's chances if they can win tonight at home. If Boston wins tonight it's gonna be a real tough uphill battle for sure. Watching these teams play is like watching two fighter throw their best punches. One of the best series in a long long time, regardless of the outcome. I have to admit though, I'm getting a little tired of the Sox schtick. and if that greasy headed pitcher wasn't throwing a greaseball last night I'll eat my hat. every time he went to the back of his head he threw a big bender for a strike.

BKB

BKB

[Buckrub]

He was on something. His eyes said so. Wild eyed.

And these beards are about to make me crazy. Boston started this STUPID 'sweatshirt hoodie' craze when they got in a few years ago. I know it's cold in Yankee Land at the end of October. But that's not what baseball players wear. But now it is. I hate it.

These guys think they're on Duck Dynasty. They are good, and Ortiz is on Fire, and they have good pitching. And the Cards are babies, except for 4 core guys.

But it is close. Dramatic. Crazy, but dramatic.

I don't think they realize I have a heart condition................

[BarryBobPosthole]

And do you think Yadi just wanted to pound Gomes on the top of his batting helmet and say 'ENOUGH ALREADY' while that Civil War Reenactor looking little fucker was doing that OCD thing with his batting helmet?

And Joe Kelley's facial tick where he winks his right eye all the time has gotten WAY out of control. These guys act nervous. I wonder why?

BKB

[Buckrub]

I did have Wong on my trade list. Lynn and Wong, I said last night. And I wore my Descalso Jersey. BUT he still gets a free pass over Kozma for hitting the same poor average. Neither can hit. Yeah maybe they'll improve some day. I hope so.

Craig can hit on a crutch with sunglasses on.

And Beltran was poised to tie the game when Wong did Wrong.

[BarryBobPosthole]

I kind of thought the same thing. And I hope we don't trade Wong. but they need to decide if he's ever going to get any better or not. With Descalso and Kozma, I think they have a lot of potential to get very good. Not so sure about Wong. He made need time too. As far as the future goes though, I'm more concerned about right field than I am the infield.
BKB

[Buckrub]

Next year Tavares will be in Right, platooning with Beltran IF he signs. Jay, Kozma, and Descalso need to hit, and Lynn needs to pitch. They are at the end of their 3 year "minimum" contracts and they're going to either be gone, or be paid bigger bucks. If you are paid bigger bucks, you hit or get released. Beltran is too good not to sign for one year, but he's hurt too much to play 180 games. Tavares can't stay in minors, he has to be brought up. Craig can play Outfield too, cause Adams is too good to get rid of. If Beltran leaves (and he might for big money elsewhere), Craig/Tavares are right, Tavares/Jay in center, and Craig/Holiday in left. But the infield HAS to be stabilized. Freese is not producing great either. He watches too many pitches.

and with all those holes, and all those rookies, they are poised to win it all. Amazing.

Axford was Mo's mistake. No good.

I sort of wonder who the pitchers are in AA right now. I mean........are there MORE of these baby wonders down the road????

[BarryBobPosthole]

The Cards are so young that its hard to imagine how good most of those players will be when they're 28-29 years old and in their professional prime. Almost all of those guys are 4-5 years from that. This team has a chance to be crazy good and they're close to that already.

BKB

[Cards01]

definitely a very talented group of young players. The off season should prove to be very interesting as well.

[DeputyDog]

Good luck keeping them all together until then.

[BarryBobPosthole]

That's the challenge these days isn't it? If we were LA or Boston or even Pittsburgh we'd be active in the trading season. Being in a smaller market though, I don't look for any major changes except for maybe to replace Beltran if we can't sign him for another two year deal. But then again, what is there to fix for the team tied for the best record in baseball and who went to the World Series? There ain't that much horribly wrong that begs to be fixed.

Good thing Bucky isn't in management or we'd all be fired or traded.

BKB

[BarryBobPosthole]

Maybe we need to trade the manager.
BKB
http://www.sportsonearth.com/article/63431206/
ST. LOUIS -- Mike Matheny is only 43 years old, but he looks to me like what a manager is supposed to look like. Intense but not scary, stoic but not removed, a contemporary of his players but still respected … Matheny is a manager the way you'd sculpt one, if you were the sort of strange person who sculpted managers. He has the jaw of a man who is constantly thinking. He always appears in charge -- like everything is under control.

None of that stuff probably should matter when it comes to the X's and O's of managing a baseball team, but it does anyway. From the day the Cardinals hired Mike Matheny to replace Tony LaRussa, this is the word everyone uses to describe Matheny: Respect. His players respect him. He has a presence. When Matheny talks, people listen. You never hear anonymous sniping about Matheny; I've never once seen a player publicly question him. All the Cardinals say they love playing for him.

This is a larger part of the job than people like you and me give it credit for. We spend most of the time watching baseball games first-, second- and eighth-guessing the manager -- and why wouldn't we? I know I can't hit a 95-mile-per-hour fastball (or probably a 59 mph one), but I can fill out a batting order, and I can call for a pinch-hitter. Shoot, I was doing that in Strat-o-Matic when I was eight. The simplicity of the action makes it seem like anyone can do it. But not anyone can. Strategy and tactics aren't the whole job; managers are managers, and they have to be able to manage people. Their employees have to want to work for them. Bosses have to make sure their orders are understood. The public face of the organization has to make it clear that he is in charge.

There's so much more to being a manager than just calling for a reliever. You must be a credible leader of men. Thus, Matheny. He is excellent at that part of the job.

But in October, nobody cares about that part of the job. There is some debate about this, but I feel pretty comfortable saying Mike Matheny bungled Game 4 of the World Series.

There were many reasons the Cardinals lost. They left a ton of runners on the bases, including an awful Jon Jay at-bat in the eighth inning. They never took advantage of a clearly pained Clay Buchholz barely touching 90 mph. They had a runner picked off first base in the ninth inning, with one of the best power hitters in postseason history at the plate. But Matheny was the main one. Matheny was the biggest reason.

It was all about that sixth inning. The game was tied 1-1 going into the inning, and Lance Lynn, like Joe Kelly the inning before, was starting to see his early dominance fade. That said, he came into the inning having only given up two hits, both to David Ortiz, who is 8-for-11 in this series because he's playing RBI Baseball, apparently. Lynn got the first two hitters before Dustin Pedroia singled. Ortiz came to the plate again. Ortiz is hitting so well right now that his walking to the plate can make a manager a bit crazed.

Matheny had two options here: stick with Lynn, or bring in Randy Choate, who was ready in the bullpen. A matchup like this is the reason you have Choate on the roster, but you could make an argument, still, for keeping Lynn in. He hadn't thrown that many pitches, and he'd settled back into a groove -- and, hey, Ortiz can't get a hit every time, can he? Lynn throws hard and was confident. Maybe he could sneak a few past Ortiz. So Matheny kept Lynn in … and then, bizarrely, had Lynn throw four pitches so far out of the strike zone that Yadier Molina had to lunge for a couple. Clearly, Lynn and Matheny wanted no part of Ortiz. Now, if you aren't going to give Ortiz anything to hit, one might argue that you'd be better off having Choate throw four breaking balls off the plate, to see if Ortiz chases any of them. But whatever.

Now you have Jonny Gomes, a guy who strikes out a ton. This is the way baseball is now, by the way: a game of the strikeout. Scoring is down the past few years for several reasons, but more than anything else, it's because of the strikeout. As an example, the Cardinals have one of the best contact rates in the majors; one of the main reasons they've had such luck hitting with runners in scoring position is because they hit the ball. The Cardinals are 26th in the majors in strikeouts this year. They're a contact team. On that high-contact team, Matt Holliday was eighth in strikeouts with 86. Those 86 strikeouts would have led the 1982 Cardinals. Baseball's strikeout rate is now 7.55 K's per nine innings, the highest in baseball history. Just nine years ago, it was 6.55. This is the direction baseball is going.

So if Gomes -- who strikes out in almost a third of his plate appearance, an astronomical number even in this era -- is up, you need a strikeout pitcher to face him. A strikeout is the most desirable out, because nothing bad can happen on a strikeout; any batted ball is an invitation for a fielder to boot it, or for it to sneak in a hole, or whatever. You need an out; a strikeout is the best way to get one. And fortunately for the Cardinals, they have a ton of strikeout pitchers; there are eight on the postseason roster who have a strikeout rate higher than the 7.55 average. At that particular moment, five of them were available in the bullpen, and another one was already on the mound.

Matheny chose none of them: He brought in Seth Maness. As I wrote on Twitter at the time, this move made no sense. The one advantage of keeping Lynn in to pitch to Ortiz was that he was getting everyone else out. One can argue whether or not Lynn should have been kept in, but it's impossible -- well, difficult, anyway -- to argue that Maness was the right call. Maness has been struggling this postseason, but more to the point, bringing him in essentially guaranteed contact. Maness is a groundball specialist -- he typically is used as Matheny's double-play good-luck charm -- with the lowest K/9 on the roster at 5.1. He is exactly the wrong person to bring in to face a hitter who strikes out a lot, when you desperately need a strikeout.

So why did Matheny make this move? Here, here we hit the source of Cardinals fans' agita with Matheny since his hiring. Matheny, a manager serving a front office that's among the most advanced in the game, trusted his eyes. He has seen Maness get out of jams before, so he wanted Maness to do it again. "He's been able to get the big out when we needed it," Matheny said postgame. "We wanted to give him a shot."

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Now, this is a common phrase for Matheny: "We wanted to give him a shot." Matheny is a man who trusts his players, who allows them to work their way out of funks, who gives them every opportunity to succeed, even as they continue to fail. (Matheny kept Edward Mujica as his closer for more than a full week after it was obvious Mujica was tired and fading, because Matheny had seen him do it before. He kept "giving him a shot.") Now, this is a terrific attribute in a manager -- a manager of people. Players love a manager who trusts them, who isn't breathing down their necks, who doesn't make them feel like they're one mistake away from the bread line. And they should! Who wouldn't want to work for a manager who trusts you implicitly?

But this isn't Little League, and this isn't some software company in a corporate complex somewhere. This is the World Series. The time to "give someone a shot" is spring training, or maybe May. It's another reason Matheny is always so slow to pull starting pitchers, which almost cost him Game 3; as a player himself, so recently, he remembers how players like to be treated. But sometimes, you have to trust the process. Sometimes, you have to be the bad guy. Matheny couldn't have known that Maness would give up a home run to Gomes, the crucial three-run blast from which the Cardinals never recovered. But he did know that Gomes was a lot more likely to hit the ball off Maness than anyone else in his bullpen. You don't want Gomes to hit the ball. Bad things happen when people hit the ball.

Mike Matheny has improved as a manager since his rookie season. He bunts a lot less, he's willing to be unconventional -- moving slow-footed Matt Carpenter to the leadoff spot early in the year kickstarted the Cardinals' season -- and he's been judicious and prudent in picking his spots for small-ball tactics like the hit-and-run and double steal. (He called a perfect one in Game 3.) He also has had a trust in young players that LaRussa never had; his willingness to prefer talent over experience in the lineup and bullpen is probably one of the reasons he got the job in the first place. I have no doubt he's going to be a solid Major League manager for a long time.

But he is still learning. This is what Cardinals fans were concerned about when Matheny was hired. He's growing into becoming a better manager … but the Cardinals are trying to win a World Series today -- like, this second. This isn't a learn-on-the-job job; let the Cubs or the Astros hire somebody like that. There's little room for error for a contending team like the Cardinals, and none in the World Series. Mistakes like Matheny's cannot happen in the World Series. The Cardinals were facing a plainly damaged pitcher on Sunday night, with a chance to take a 3-1 lead, with their ace on the mound poised to clinch a title at home on Monday night. It was all there for them. But with one wrong move, and one high sinker, and one bat-on-ball contact, it all went away. Now the series is tied. Now we're going to back to Boston.

Mike Matheny didn't back down from his mistake. "[Maness] is a guy that we go to, to get us out of tough spots whenever we're in question," Matheny said. "We'll use him again in that situation." Maybe Matheny means that. Maybe he's just protecting his player -- being that leader of men. Maybe he learned a lesson on Sunday night; maybe he didn't. But the real question is whether or not someone should be learning lessons in Game 4 of the World Series in the first place. Mike Matheny is going to be a well-rounded, top-tier manager in the big leagues someday. But the Cardinals need him to be one right now.

[Chicken Dinner]

Be careful pinning too many year to year hopes on young guys as well. Development is rarely a linear movement. See the 2013 Nationals.

[Buckrub]

Cards front office is not like the rest.

Matheny is a "Baby Bird" at HIS job too. I'm impressed they got this far, amazed really............but they are liable to do it all, who knows?

I'm impressed. Lost the SS, Pitching Ace, and Closer, before it even started. Patched stuff together. Moved kids up, and along. Did it the right way, not the stupid Yankee way. Class organization.

There are not 12 Front-Of-Rotation pitchers on anyone's staff. These guys do remind me of Maddux/Avery/Glavine, though. There are not 13 .300 hitters on anyone's bench. There are not Gold Glovers either. If they were out there, we might could trade for them. But there are not. I want to trade Wong and Lynn and Jay for Andrew McCutcheon. Ain't gonna happen!!!!

[DeputyDog]

A big part of it is will management raise the payroll enough to keep them? There isn't any loyalty to cities or teams anymore by players, and less to players by management. Just ask Brett Favre or Peyton Manning.

[Arty]

You're probably right.

Upon reflection, I'd say more like 155. I do think I missed about 10 games for some reason. 162 regular season, plus playoffs (which I sure ain't missed. I take my TV with me now!!! :))



How many hours in front of a tv is that? You act like you are retired or something.

[Captain]

How many hours in front of a tv is that? You act like you are retired or something.

That's exactly what I was thinking when he posted that first number. At 3 to 4 hours a game that is a LOT of time that could be used for working on deer stuff, food plots or general exercise or even fishing. Ain't no ball of no type gonna steal that kinda time from me. I ain't no couch tater....
Take Care, Captain

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

[BarryBobPosthole]

If you were, you'd be of the size that goes well with green beans.

BKB

[Captain]

I ain't too far from that now.... :(

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

[Buckrub]

Most of these are at times I wouldn't be doing anything anyway.......7 at night usually. And I watch with my wife, a bigger fan than I am. She'd dump me and marry Yadi tomorrow, I guarantee. It's something we do together. And we do it at least a half a year.

I'm actually a bit torqued that I didn't jump on tickets for the postseason and go when ML season was in here in Arkansas. I'd rather have spent a few days in STL watching these guys than sitting in a tree watching trees. Not all season, but a day or two. Maybe that's cause I never got to go up there this summer. That won't happen again.

I love 'em. I love the Razorbacks, but they suck. Maybe before long, but not now. Now, the Cards have it.

Baseball is the game I could have played. Should have played. Maybe all in my head, but who cares. I believe it. I love watching it. I love every crazy nuance of it. The hardest single thing in all of sports to do is to hit a round baseball coming at 90 mph from 60 feet away with a round wooden stick. Nothing comes close to being that hard to do. And I love the math. And I love watching it with my wife.....or not......and absorbing it all. And I believe I'm a fan of the single most wonderful MLB franchise in the history of the game.

Go Cards. I'm proud of ya, whatever. But man.......you're messing with my atrial valves, guys. Try to blow someone out, willya?

[BarryBobPosthole]

I'm predicting big offense fromthe birds tonight.

BKB

[BarryBobPosthole]

Did you add Jon Jay to your trade list? He's on mine.
BKB

[Buckrub]

Big offense? How? 43 hit by pitches in a row???

[Chicken Dinner]

Not sure which is worse - Carpenter's error or the failure to execute the run down...

[Buckrub]

There is a very long list of things I can think of to say, right now.

I will just say one of them.

Pitchers and Catchers report Feb 24.