I just realized a couple of things....

[Big Muddy]

Actually, it's not my thoughts....too profound for my little brain....a buddy emailed this to me:

No living person born in the United States has ever OWNED a slave.
No living person born in the United States has ever BEEN a slave.
White folks are being blamed for an offense they did NOT commit, against Black folks who were NOT even alive, to be offended.
Yet, we argue over a piece of colored cloth, when truly important issues that deserve our attention, go unattended.

[BarryBobPosthole]

But seriously.....who is doing the blaming and whom are they blaming? Just cite an example or two. And what black people are saying they're offended? Again, just an example or two. And who's doing the arguing over the flag?

I guess I'm not being the senior noticer or something but the only people I see complaining ain't the people you write about!

BKB

[Captain]

Barry, you must be living in another world if you ain't seeing them complain.

[Buckrub]

I don't even know how to discuss this stuff anymore. The whole country is living in two worlds. One of them is Bizarro World.

[BarryBobPosthole]

Then cite a couple of examples! It shouldn't be that hard.

BKB

[Big Muddy]

Barry, you really need to keep up with the news about this....just here in MS alone, there's about 15 city councils(with a black majority) who are demanding removal of our state flag from any gov't building....I know of some that have already succumbed....Grenada, MS for one....I've already added my name to the long list of folks who have sworn to never shop there, ever again....and, it's not just the flags....how about this:


Maria Boynton
Maria Boynton was named anchor of CBS Radio Atlanta V-103’s:
July 13, 2015

"""The Atlanta Chapter of the NAACP is calling for the removal of the Confederacy from Stone Mountain Park. Local chapter president Richard Rose says, “It is time for Georgia and other Southern states to end the glorification of slavery and white supremacy, paid for and maintained, with the taxes of all its citizens.” According to Rose, “all of this recognition of Confederate generals is upholding the white supremacy on which the Confederacy was founded and the war was fought.” He goes on to say, “all of this should have ended in 1865 when Lee surrendered to Appomattox.” He’s referring to, what historians refer to as, one of the last battles before Confederate Army General Robert Lee surrendered to Union Army Lt. Ulysses Grant on April 9, 1865.

Recent debate about the emblems was sparked by the mass killings at Emanuel A.M.E. Church in Charleston, South Carolina. Alleged gunman Dylann Roof was seen in photographs posing with the Confederate Flag. While some consider the flag as a commemoration of their heritage, others consider it a symbol of hate. On Friday, South Carolina removed the flag from its statehouse grounds.

Georgia removed the Confederate emblem from its flag in 2001, though the “Stars and Bars” from the First National Confederate Flag remain on the state flag. The Confederate Flag still flies at Stone Mountain Park, which is owned by and run by the State of Georgia. Many, like Congressman Hank Johnson see the park as a museum for the Confederacy. According to Johnson, “where do we draw the line, do we blast the faces off of Stone Mountain?” Rose says “yes”. He adds, “they can sand blast Lee, Jefferson Davis, and Jackson off tomorrow. I’d be extremely elated.”
Rose calls it “unfair, unfortunate, and unconscionable for the State of Georgia and any other government to continue to commemorate and spend taxpayer dollars in upholding and preserving Confederate monuments and symbols including the flag.” On any government property, Rose says, “those symbols should be eradicated.”

A compromise, Rose says, would be to “add other figures to Stone Mountain”, those who he says have been “instrumental in bringing peace between the races” and in “elevating Georgia beyond the Civil War and Jim Crow eras.”

-Maria Boynton, CBS Local

[Buckrub]

The Memphis City Council voted to dig up the grave of some Confederate General, beats me who, and .........move him somewhere.

Sounds like a huge complaint about "The South" to me. What else is that? Before SC flag came down, they were marching in the streets "complaining" that it should be down.

If no one has complained about all this, who's generating the fuss over it?????????????????????????????????????????????

[No-till Boss]

That white female representative or senator from SC on the news bawling about the flag made me sick. I hope every person that ever vote for her stupid ass regrets it.

[airbud7]

That white female representative or senator from SC on the news bawling about the flag made me sick. I hope every person that ever vote for her stupid ass regrets it.

She's called the Governor....I voted for her...And No...I don't regret it...

[BarryBobPosthole]

The Memphis City Council voted to dig up the grave of some Confederate General, beats me who, and .........move him somewhere.

Sounds like a huge complaint about "The South" to me. What else is that? Before SC flag came down, they were marching in the streets "complaining" that it should be down.

If no one has complained about all this, who's generating the fuss over it?????????????????????????????????????????????

It was Nathan Bedford Forrest, first ever Grand Wizard of the Ku Klux Klan. Hardly a bastion of racism.

BKB

[BarryBobPosthole]

She's called the Governor....I voted for her...And No...I don't regret it...

Like

[No-till Boss]

She's called the Governor....I voted for her...And No...I don't regret it...

You should, that was some embarrassing shit......

[Buckrub]

It was Nathan Bedford Forrest, first ever Grand Wizard of the Ku Klux Klan. Hardly a bastion of racism.

BKB
Who repudiated it later, but the point was, I found a case of someone complaining about things. You asked. There's one.

[Big Muddy]

The Nathan Bedford Forrest complaint has been squashed:

"""The gentleman you see in the light green shirt is Mr. Kevin Bradley. Mr. Bradley is the Great-Great Grandson of General Nathan Bedford Forrest. Mr. Bradley, today, said publicly that he nor his family will allow the grave robbers on the Memphis city council to remove his grandfather. General and Mrs. Forrest cannot be removed without the family's permission, no matter what you're told. The ghouls on the Memphis city council will have to find another cemetery to disturb."""


5102

[Buckrub]

It was Nathan Bedford Forrest, first ever Grand Wizard of the Ku Klux Klan. Hardly a bastion of racism.

BKB

And Gen. Sherman was a really nice guy who never hurt anyone needlessly, too.

[Big Muddy]

Here's some more for you, Phole:

Councilman Stokes is black, btw.

http://www.wapt.com/politics/stokes-introducing-resolution-calling-for-new-state-flag/34142168



JACKSON, Miss. —Jackson City Councilman Kenneth Stokes will introduce a resolution Tuesday that calls for the state to find a new flag design without the Confederate battle emblem.

[Buckrub]

I think I just realized a couple of things, too.

[Captain]

5108

[Captain]

A black judge, offended by a white family’s concern that their toddler was frightened of black men after a violent home invasion and robbery, publicly shamed them and let off the convicted man with mere probation.

When Gregory Wallace was sentenced for alleged armed home invasion near Buechel, Kentucky, Judge Olu Stevens “slammed” the homeowners, Jordan and Tommy Gray, for not correcting their daughter’s fear of black men.

Wallace, who was convicted of robbery, had been found guilty of participating in the March 2013 armed home invasion, in which he and another black suspect burst into the Gray’s home and held the parents and their three-year-old daughter at gunpoint.

According to The Courier-Journal, prior to Wallace’s sentencing, Jordan Gray confessed that since the horrible home invasion, her young daughter had been terrified of black men: “Whenever we are running errands, if we come across a black male, she holds me tight and begs me to leave. It has affected her friendships at school, and our relationships with African-American friends.”

The father also indicated that his daughter has been “terrified of black males” since the home invasion.

Judge Stevens, who is also black, reacted to the Grays’ concerns by calling them racists.

“I am offended… I am deeply offended that they would be victimized by an individual and express some kind of fear of all black men,” he said. He said it was understandable that the three-year-old was upset — “she can’t help the way she feels” — but he attacked the parents for “accepting that kind of mentality and fostering those type of stereotypes.”

The Grays asked the judge to give Wallace a more serious sentence: “If holding a little girl at gunpoint gets you probation, then our system is flawed,” the girl’s father said.

Stevens ignored their pleas and sentenced Wallace to five year’s probation, saying he “deserved the opportunity to redeem himself” for violently invading the Grays’ home, terrorizing their daughter, and stealing their property.

Later, Stevens took to Facebook to publicly shame the victims of a home invasion after giving Wallace merely probation for burglary and robbery with a handgun. It was the mother’s secret racist views that made the toddler terrified of black men, not the formative memory of being terrorized at gunpoint by violent criminals:

Court brought it front and center this week. The case involved a burglary and the victims were a young couple and their three year-old child. The written victim impact statement on behalf of the child read that as a result of the offense committed against her parents in her presence, the child is in “constant fear of black men.” The statement, written by her mother, continues that the child clings to her parent when in the presence of any black man. The incident, the mother concluded, “has even affected our relationship with our African-American friends.”

I read this statement aloud in open court. For a reason. It was of little surprise to me that neither parent nor the child was present in court for the sentencing. After all, the defendant and the judge are amongst the individuals the three year old has fear of as a result of the crime. Do three year olds form such generalized, stereotyped and racist opinions of others? I think not. Perhaps the mother had attributed her own views to her child as a manner of sanitizing them.

[Thumper]

WTF???


Later, Stevens took to Facebook to publicly shame the victims ....

Surely that would be grounds for disbarment ... or at minimum a reprimand. No?

I remember when I was a kid, my buddy's little sister was bitten (not mauled, but a nasty bite) by a stray dog. She had to go through the trauma of the attack as well as the pain of treatments (stitches, etc), including rabies shots. Even though the family had always been dog lovers, the girl was terrified any time a dog got near her after that. I've always wondered if she ever got over that. (he was a friend at school and they moved away a year or so later)

I'm just wondering if this judge would have thought her fear of dogs was her parents fault?

[Captain]

And all we hear are crickets out of Postholes corner. ;)

[Thumper]

SD'er

[Big Muddy]

I wonder if Phole attended, this rally in OKC to greet Odingdong. ;)
And, guess who organized the rebel flag rally....a black guy!!!

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2015/07/15/obama-greeted-in-oklahoma-city-with-protesters-displaying-confederate-flags/

[BarryBobPosthole]

Nope I didn't attend. If y'all are so proud of the rebel flag, maybe you ought to put one up on the site. After all, its just a heritagecthing.

BKB

[Big Muddy]

I'll vote for that!!! ;)

[Nandy]

If y'all are so proud of the rebel flag, maybe you ought to put one up on the site. After all, its just a heritagecthing.

BKB

Only if I can wrap myself around it!

[Buckrub]

There's not more than a thousand at this camp site.

Last year same place, zero.

But that was a weak comeback. The man said, twice, that no black folks were offended! When proven wrong, change the subject. I always try to do that!

[Captain]

Nope I didn't attend. If y'all are so proud of the rebel flag, maybe you ought to put one up on the site. After all, its just a heritagecthing. BKB

5127

I could go for this one as I'm equally proud of my heritage... Sorry part of it offends some folks. But bottom line is I was not alive back in them days, or I would have had to shoot JB.. :D
I can see where the confederate flag could offend some folks, less for the use during the war of Northern aggression and more for the use of some stupid closed minded groups that sprung up later. But none the less I can see it. I do think it is being carried a bit to far however.

[Captain]

We could use this one.
5128
Or the one Clinton used in the south in the early 90's
5129
Or perhaps the lates version that Posty might like... ;)
5130

[Nandy]

We could use this one.
5128


Yeah, I love to use that one too... :like

[Thumper]

"X" marks the spot! (ALL of 'em!) :D

[Mrs. Niner]

Bless your hearts! You really had me....there I was reading along and then WHACK, right in the face with that!

But then I realized that all the blood just drained from your poor little haids and landed in your zipper.........well i know you just cant help it! :biggrin

[Thumper]

Di, please don't take this wrong ... but am I allowed to say, "I love you?" :D

[BarryBobPosthole]

The confederate flag wavers that greeted The president were mostly from Texas (at least they had Texas plates)and were ran off from every place they tried to hold their 'rally'. So they ended up just driving around waving their flags. Oklahoma wasn't even a state during the Civil War so we don't have a dog in this fight, nor do we have the same 'heritage' as other states.

And as far as your examples, you said in your first post that today's whites never owned slaves and were being blamed for things they didn't even do. I asked for examples. None have been provided. All you've provided are examples of duly elected officials taking steps to remove things they consider offensive. Just like South Carolina did. Nobody that I know of has accused any whites of doing anything in those cases.

I agree that nobody of our generation has done any of these things that are being talked about. I also agree they're being overblown. But if you can't see why black people would be offended by glorification (by statues, flags, etc) of the people that actually did do those things then you are being either intentionally thick headed or you're just blowing the same hard wind that a lot of others are.

What some of these black 'leadership' organizations are doing is weong headed. It is equally wrong headed to totally ignore what they are saying. But I reckon that is what we call discourse in this country.

BKB

[Captain]

Every slave ship that went to and came back from Africa was flying the American flag. So I guess we need to get rid of that one too. Right.

[BarryBobPosthole]

The states under that same flag also emancipated the slaves and made it illegal.

Using your logic, if I had German ancestry, then Jews shouldn't find any offense if I decided to fly a swastika on my flag pole in my yard. I mean, after all, I didn't commit any of those crimes did I? It is part of every German's 'heritage' (aka 'history') is it not?

I am ambivalent, as I have been from the beginning, about what another state has as their flag and what people they want to call heroes and erect statues to. But being ambivalent about it doesn't mean I don't see and hear the reasons for their arguments. So far from what I've heard from both sides, there's a whole lot of wind and not very much substance either way. Its mostly a big knee jerk reaction from the side wanting to pull them down and a ton of bullshit from the other. And now, about all we've accomplished is a bunch of white people now consider themselves 'offended' about something they claim they didn't even have anything to do with! How much fucking sense does that make, Larke?

And in the end, no matter how many symbols we yank down and how many rallies we have to wave a flag that is supposedlyothing more than a battle flag, not one iota of progress will have been made towards understanding why that crazy motherfucker killed those people. Not one step will have been taken to prevent the next one (becacuse iMO there aren't any realisitic ones we can take) and about all we will have accomplished is we will have forgotten about the victims and their families and replaced them with a bunch of new 'victims'.

In short, grow the fuck up.

BKB

[No-till Boss]

The states under that same flag also emancipated the slaves and made it illegal.

Using your logic, if I had German ancestry, then Jews shouldn't find any offense if I decided to fly a swastika on my flag pole in my yard. I mean, after all, I didn't commit any of those crimes did I? It is part of every German's 'heritage' (aka 'history') is it not?

I am ambivalent, as I have been from the beginning, about what another state has as their flag and what people they want to call heroes and erect statues to. But being ambivalent about it doesn't mean I don't see and hear the reasons for their arguments. So far from what I've heard from both sides, there's a whole lot of wind and not very much substance either way. Its mostly a big knee jerk reaction from the side wanting to pull them down and a ton of bullshit from the other. And now, about all we've accomplished is a bunch of white people now consider themselves 'offended' about something they claim they didn't even have anything to do with! How much fucking sense does that make, Larke?

And in the end, no matter how many symbols we yank down and how many rallies we have to wave a flag that is supposedlyothing more than a battle flag, not one iota of progress will have been made towards understanding why that crazy motherfucker killed those people. Not one step will have been taken to prevent the next one (becacuse iMO there aren't any realisitic ones we can take) and about all we will have accomplished is we will have forgotten about the victims and their families and replaced them with a bunch of new 'victims'.

In short, grow the fuck up.

BKB

Sympathizer....... You're the Jane Fonda of Oklahoma !

[LJ3]

It's a flag people. It has the power that you provide to it. It does nothing on its own.

[BarryBobPosthole]

Sympathizer....... You're the Jane Fonda of Oklahoma !

She has nicer titties. And more expensive ones too!

BKB

[Chicken Dinner]

There you go speaking "truth" again...


It's a flag people. It has the power that you provide to it. It does nothing on its own.

[Thumper]

Personally? I could give a rat's ass either way. :D

[Buckrub]

The states under that same flag also emancipated the slaves and made it illegal.

BKB

Wrong!
The Emancipation Proclamation freed zero Northern slaves!! Only Southern ones!

Good grief, man!

And only 1.4% of Southerners owned slaves anyway.

Gag me.

[Buckrub]

If the current argument was "We want to own slaves now", maybe your arguments might have a smidgen of validity. But they don't.

And here I am doing what I said I wouldn't do, because it's so flipping useless!!

[Thumper]

And here I am doing what I said I wouldn't do, because it's so flipping useless!!

What? Talking to yourself? ;)

[BarryBobPosthole]

Wrong!
The Emancipation Proclamation freed zero Northern slaves!! Only Southern ones!

Good grief, man!



And only 1.4% of Southerners owned slaves anyway.

Gag me.


So. Here you are saying this whole slavery thing didn't exist, niggers ate better off because we brought the, hete chained int the bottom of ships than they wpuld be had we left the, with their families and friends, and since we're not slave owners we ha e some fucking get out of jail free card when it comes to racism.

I got it now. No need for further discussion.

BKB

[Thumper]

I think P-hole's been in the squeezin's again!

(but I think I filled in the blanks and figured it out) ;)

[Buckrub]

So. Here you are saying this whole slavery thing didn't exist, niggers ate better off because we brought the, hete chained int the bottom of ships than they wpuld be had we left the, with their families and friends, and since we're not slave owners we ha e some fucking get out of jail free card when it comes to racism.

I got it now. No need for further discussion.

BKB

What a nut.

Do you think we chased down free black folks in Africa and brought em here in chains?

"We" bought em from their original black owners.

Your realm of reality is skewed and borders on insanity. I keep trying to ignore it but you're SO out there it's hard to take.

[BarryBobPosthole]

I know history pretty well. I'm pretty sure the rationalization that slave buyers and users are somehow in the right since they bought slaves from people of their own color is a really fucking empty vessel. There quite simply isn't any way out for anyone who ever has claimed another human being.

BKB

[BarryBobPosthole]

I see, so the European slave owners are completely off the hook! Thats kind of like having your own Ben Carson isn't it

BKB

[BarryBobPosthole]

Okay. Sorry. It was the black people's fault. Fly your flag!

BKB

[Captain]

Posthole. What an ugly thing to say. I arbor ugliness. Does this mean we're not friends anymore? You know Posty, if I thought you weren't my friend, I don't think I could bear it... :D

[Buckrub]

No slavery ever existed as perverse as welfare.
It covers all races, it's sanctioned, it's falsely believed to help people, and it's not even effective.

But all this crap above is crap. Sarcasm doesn't substitute for rational discussion. And the rancor is unneeded and unappreciated. Some folks argue like 14 year old girls, and wrong ones at that. And some people are way too smart to be this wrong and this silly.

[Thumper]

So, let me get this straight in case I ever have a problem with Johnny Law.

The way I'm reading this, if a drug dealer sells high grade coke to another drug dealer ... then he steps on it and I buy it from him ... I'm innocent, correct? ;)

[Captain]

So, let me get this straight in case I ever have a problem with Johnny Law. The way I'm reading this, if a drug dealer sells high grade coke to another drug dealer ... then he steps on it and I buy it from him ... I'm innocent, correct? ;)

WTF???? I don't understand your comparison?

[Thumper]

Black slave traders selling black slaves to white folk. The white folk are innocent in all'o this. Right? :stirthepot

[Buckrub]

What's that got to do with anything?

No one is advocating slavery as viable.

We're just trying to correct historical mistakes and fight back to those little girls who demand others grow up, rather than have meaningful discussions and realize it's possible to view life differently.

[Buckrub]

Black slave traders selling black slaves to white folk. The white folk are innocent in all'o this. Right? :stirthepot

Odd talk fir a man who doesn't give a rats.

[Captain]

Black slave traders selling black slaves to white folk. The white folk are innocent in all'o this. Right? :stirthepot
Nope, but the white slave traders are no more guilty than the black slave traders. And the black slave traders are not more innocent than the white ones.
Seems history (and people) want to lay all the blame on just ONE of those groups.

[Thumper]

Odd talk fir a man who doesn't give a rats.

That doesn't mean I can't "instigate". ;)

[Thumper]

I've been just dying to quote somebody here who won't let us quote. But I have to admit I got a kick out of this one! This poster shall remain anonymous of course. :D


I'll bet the majority of the black race screaming about slavery were never a slave.

I'd say that's a pretty safe bet! :biggrin

[Captain]

OHhhhhhhhn are you in trouble!

I bet you done got 3 text!

[Thumper]

I put my phone on the charger in the other room! ;)

[Big Muddy]

5138

[Arty]

I've been just dying to quote somebody here who won't let us quote. But I have to admit I got a kick out of this one! This poster shall remain anonymous of course. :D I'd say that's a pretty safe bet! :biggrin


It's a bet I'd take any day of the week!