If I was a Cop Today

[LJ3]

I would walk to my Captains office and resign, effective today. What's happening to our Law Enforcement Officers is beyond tragic and completely 10,000,000% undeserved. I blame stupid people in large numbers, ignorant MF'ers in even larger numbers, and I blame social media.

[Chicken Dinner]

It can't be social media's fault because it's the gun's fault.

[Hombre]

I don't think its just social media, although I think that plays a huge role. Look at the news and tell me that 99% of what you see, read, hear isn't negative on both sides. Very little about all the good cops do, very little about community peaceful demonstrations. There is a whole lot about police abuse of power and communities tearing themselves apart. I watched a program yesterday where the were discussing the tension and one of the guests stood up and said to a retired cop " you have to understand you're pushing us to where we're going to shoot back" the cop responded " I 34,000 of my brothers will be shooting at you"....Both are wrong imo. That is the huge divide we have right now nothing is rationale.

On your first point I agree. Cops have the toughest job in the world and get very little credit for the 99.999999999 that they do right. I would hate to be in a position, because all that is going on right now, to have to make a split second call while second guessing because of the scrutiny.

[Thumper]

Kinda related, kinda not. I was in my office but could hear the tv in the other room. The conversation was about the possibility of making "Black Lives Matter" an official hate group. Heck, I didn't even know they were an organized "group" ... I though it was just something people were using as a rallying point.

[LJ3]

It's ridiculous. I think my saltiness toward social media as that irresponsible, sometimes insane, and seriously skewed perspectives are given credence that would never have existed before twitter or anything else.

[Nandy]

There is no respect for the police any longer. society is crumbling... This one I can see it happening, cop chasing the bad guys and get shots (not that I take it light...), but like the other one in TX where the officer was plain executed while he was not actively working on a crime is beyond my understanding(unless it is a vendetta for something, still not warranted).
This place is going straight to hell... I guess Im heading to the Netherlands, I try to settle on one of those municipalities that speak English, im to old to learn Dutch...

[LJ3]

Kinda related, kinda not. I was in my office but could hear the tv in the other room. The conversation was about the possibility of making "Black Lives Matter" an official hate group. Heck, I didn't even know they were an organized "group" ... I though it was just something people were using as a rallying point.

That's part of my point. #blacklivesmatter exists ONLY because of social media, twitter to be exact. It's given a voice to bullshit words that would otherwise be ignored. Too many ignorant people assign some sort of enhanced credibility to something that's seen "online" because they are dim, dull, ignorant, stupid, void of logic and unable to think for themselves.

[quercus alba]

C'mon Len, don't be so Wishy washy, how do you really feel?

[LJ3]

I need a fuckin' mass taser :)

[Thumper]

Another cop killed in Chicago today. (in the line of duty)

[Buckrub]

Kinda related, kinda not. I was in my office but could hear the tv in the other room. The conversation was about the possibility of making "Black Lives Matter" an official hate group. Heck, I didn't even know they were an organized "group" ... I though it was just something people were using as a rallying point.
Extremely organized. Actually an Acorn group. Read their demands on their website. Please....

Read elsewhere what they chanted today about cops.

Hate group indeed.

This group believes only black lives matter.

Sorry to offend anyone.

[BarryBobPosthole]

So Black Lives Matter is responsible for these killings? Is that what you're saying? Just want to be clear who you hold responsible for it.

BKB

[Buckrub]

To some degree yes sir. Most cops are too.

Just to be clear.

Go read their Web site.

[BarryBobPosthole]

Sorry, I don't see it that way. Murders like this are done by assholes with no value at all for human lives. They feel no guilt for these kilings. They are psychopaths. And those assholes are produced more by circumstances than they are by their race. To the extent that minorities are more likely to be raised in those circumstances, then yeah you start to see race trends. But this is a result of the overall breakdown in human values in our society, not triggered by some organization. what do you want to do, make it illegal for people to form organizations like Black Lives Matter?
I think its a pretty easy answer to say these killings are triggered by the media coverage of police shootings too. Maybe in some isolated incidents sure, but to blame the media and organizations like these are the simple answers we'd like to hear rather than the tough answers that are likely. Personally, I think our criminal justice system is oartly to blame. Our prison grind out these assholes like sausage. And to incarcerate more people and produce more assholes won't solve anything.
look at the arrest records of the people doing this stuff. By and large these are career criminals and you have to ask yourself where they learned to be like they are.
bKB

[Buckrub]

Don't care where they learned it or how. "Society is to blame" is a copout to let people not be accountable for their actions. Will never buy it. That group is not directly responsible of course. Every man stands alone.

But there are groups advocating open war on cops and they are not blameless. And I bet you've not investigated them any more than you investigated Jeremiah Wrights website when I told y'all about it 7 years ago to the day.

Your eyes are not open because it would violate your agenda. I suppose in one strange way Society has some blame.....if Society can be another name for Government. Because I do blame them for creating a system of handouts that erase individuality and breed people who demand everything be given them at any cost......which is what their website demands.

I stand by my beliefs. A Hate Group identical to the Klan IMHO.

[Hombre]

I think an indirect tie can be made. It's not 100% right / 100% wrong discussion. Everyone that is part of the blacklivesmatter movement isn't hoping to create a racial divide a whole lot want to see peaceful improvement . But, I think that it has an impact, and that has lead to more extremism. Extreme people latch onto causes that are polarized in a direction, and that goes for both sides. As posted above I've seen both sides say some crazy stuff along the lines of "us vs them" that is the problem to me with a blacklivesmatter, whether intentional or not it is fostering a divide.

[Buckrub]

No of course everyone isn't. But the group is organized, financed, and has stated written demands. It's not some meme.

And while we're falling all over our respective Johnsons trying to not blame anyone, the FACT is that cops are being mowed down. They don't want us to carry a gun and now they want all cops dead. Amazing. Maybe the Army can come save us......

[BarryBobPosthole]

I'm trying to figure out why that group is even in the discussion about these police killings. you both claim they are responsible yet you feel the need to being them up. Do I agree with them? No, I don't. But they have the same first amendment rights everyone else does. Do they advocate killing policemen? No they don't.

These killings are individual responsiblilities. And the real copout is to claim there is some 'trigger' that made them do what they did when in reality it didn't trigger shit. at most its a weak ass excuse.

And if we want to start looking for respect of law enforcement we might try practicing what we preach with respect to others around us. No, I didn't say tolerance. I said respect.

And WTF does ACORN have to do with this? Other than the usual tie in to Obama.

BKB

[Buckrub]

Tracing the funding of the group leads to Acorn. Of course you won't believe that or check it out.

When this group that was marching heard of the cop in Chicago being killed, the began chanting "Pigs in a blanket, let's fry some bacon".

Believe whatever you wish.

[BarryBobPosthole]

And just FYI, the number of police killed in the lone of duty is on a downward trend and has been for many years.

That doesn't make a hoot of a difference to the families of those killed, but police aren't 'getting mowed down'.

bKB

[Hombre]

One I can disagree with a movement and it doesn't mean that I don't have respect for the people. Its totally possible for good people to support a cause with intentions that don't show up as a result. Also, I never said they are chanting any type of hate. Finally, I never said I want to stamp out their first amendment right, and completely fine with that I just don't think it has the positive impact. Are you suggesting I should limit my first amendment right so others don't feel I encroached upon theirs? Just want to make sure I understand the logic? If I disagree, even with just the results not the message I am impeding their rights, If they disagree they are exercising their rights.

[Buckrub]

Well, my position is valid and yours is total ca ca.

[Captain]

Posthole you are wrong on this issue. The movement is triggering folks to do things like this.

[Captain]

5521

[BarryBobPosthole]

the police killing unarmed people is triggering this. Now I realize as much as everyone else that that's about 1/1000 of the total population of cops. But if there's anything that's risen statistically its the number of killings by police. And the ones where they pull someboduy over for something innocuious and end up killing an unarmed person is always going to make the news and rightfully so. It was those deals that started the whole thing and right or wrong, you can't argue with the numbers.

BKB

[Captain]

the police killing unarmed people is triggering this. Now I realize as much as everyone else that that's about 1/1000 of the total population of cops. But if there's anything that's risen statistically its the number of killings by police. And the ones where they pull someboduy over for something innocuious and end up killing an unarmed person is always going to make the news and rightfully so. It was those deals that started the whole thing and right or wrong, you can't argue with the numbers. BKB

Sure I can.... Have you forgot to whom you speak?

[Buckrub]

America divided.

[Nandy]

the police killing unarmed people is triggering this.
BKB

Nah, someone is using that as an excuse. It ain the black lives matter either...

[Buckrub]

Apparently deeply and irrevocably.

[BarryBobPosthole]

I havent forgotten to whom I'm speaking and I respect everything you have to say, particularly on this matter but more than most everyone else on about anything else. But you're full of shit as a Christmas turkey on this one.

The real poser on this whole deal is that violent crimes are actually going down while the number of people incarcerated is going up dramatically. We incarcerate more people than any other modern nation in the entire world. And our prisons are factories where real racial hatred and real criminals are created. At least that's what I think is the root cause of this. That doesn't mean some asshole somewhere isn't going to use it as an excuse, after all that fucker in South Carolina did.

BKB

[Buckrub]

Who said incarcerated people had anything to do with this?

Only you brought that up, oddly so.

Besidez, if you don't want to be incarcerated don't do crimes. I've never been.

[Captain]

Yep and he was a dumbass and the folks of Charleston stood above his racial crap. They acted like class people. I hope the shooter in that case burns in Hell. It was without a doubt a racial shooting and to sit with a group in Gods house and Bible study with, pray with them and then kill them is as bad as I've ever heard.
But where was all the looking and store burnings and riots in Huston when the guy (black) shot the cop 15 times? And be certain of one thing, he didn't just shoot him cause he was a cop, he shot him because he was a white cop!
When you have a racist group like this black live matters that want to separate themselves by race spouting off "pigs in a blanket fry them like bacon" this moves people to do things they probably would not otherwise do. So yes they do hold some responsibility.
There is a real push on in this country to target cops. I'm still active and I read the Intel reports. If you choose to not believe it that's fine. But don't tell me I'm FOS on a matter that I'm close to.

[Buckrub]

I simply don't understand postholes position on this. I don't get it. Why? SO far off base. I honestly try. I cant.

How did we get to this point?

[BarryBobPosthole]

You think its odd that I think there's a more fundamental problem than 'niggers' that's the reason for this shit?

Give me a fucking large break if you have trouble understanding that I think its a little more complicatied than that.


BKB

[Buckrub]

Good grief man.

I'm not instigating this hate or language, ok?

Stop assuming.

Later

[Nandy]

'niggers'
BKB

Oh no he didnt! lol! sorry, I have no idea why I am laughing so hard cuz you use the N word...

I will be hard to turn to believe that "black lives matter" itself has anything to do with a person killing a police officer, which would not otherwise had done it. I believe there is a war out there but it has been brewing for quite some time. If I were to blame I would blame the media who has a large impact on peoples perception and could influence people better. Just like propaganda during the war and they are loving it because it is job security for them....

PS - I cant even believe I am participating in this discussion...

[Hombre]

Somebody hasn't had his calming glass of juicy fruit yet!

[Captain]

I ain't stirring the pot and would heap rather talk fishing or hunting.
Barry you seem to think because we have such high crime rates and are sending so many folks to prison is somewhat out of skew with the rest of the world. But the real reason is the other countries still PUNISH folks for crimes committed.
Here it is a joke, a person has to be convicted MANY times BEFORE they go to prison. And then it's some small sentence in which they will receive "good time", "day for day credit" "gain time" time off for cleaning up their own cell or delivering magazines in the block.... A 20 year sentence here MAY mean 3 years. And there is probably a trail of 20 or thirty people that were victimized
Before that sentence was passed. The court and prison system is nothing for criminals to worry about. THATS the reason we are seeing revolving door inmates and that's the reason we are imprisoning so many people. It's the same career criminals. If we started locking criminals up for real time (20 years means 20 years) and they figured out time MEANS time you will see the crime go down. And in twenty years you could close have the prisons in the country cause folks would once again not want to be a part of it.

[Thumper]

One thing I've noticed when traveling the world is the fact ANY American I ever ran into would always say if they ever screwed up and ended up in prison in (insert any foreign country here) they would do everything possible to get sent back to the United States to serve their term. There's a reason for that. Generally, foreign prisons are no country club! We need to take lessons and make our prisons an actual punishment instead of a short vacation between crime sprees.

I think this "Black Lives Matter" does instigate crimes against cops. It's the old "gang mentality". You see a-holes rioting after simple things like a loss at a rival football game. People didn't go to the game planning to riot if their team lost. A small group of ne'er-do-wells get the emotions stirred up and the "piling on" begins. You see it many times ... rock concerts, whatever. That's what happens with groups like this. Certainly no good can come from it.

[BarryBobPosthole]

Your belief in that shows that you don't have the foggiest notion of the kind of people that are involved in that movement, as misguided as it might be.

BKB

[Nandy]

Are we talking here about "Black lives matter" or the "black panthers". the idea of BLM is to serve as a watchman for police brutality against black people. It does not calls for illegal acts. Now, you can have someone claiming or even being part of the group and do something stupid and that dont means the organization support that. Heck, this is a very disorganized group to the point that there not seems to have a real organization structure... A police officer makes a mistake or abuse his powers does not makes every other police officer the same, neither does one psychopath that claims being part of a group make the rest of the group a psychopath....

[Thumper]

Maybe if the group was called "Lives Matter" it would make more sense. Example, have you ever even heard the name Dillon Taylor? If not, why not? He was an unarmed white kid shot by a black cop just last month (Salt Lake City I believe). The way I understand it, he had ear plugs in his ears listening to his iPod or whatever. He matched the description of somebody in the area who was seen "waving a gun around". The kid reached down to turn off his iPod (or pull up his pants, whatever) and was shot dead. Unarmed white kid/black cop! Is it only BLACK lives that matter? If there needs to be a movement to weed out trigger happy cops, what the fuck does color have to do with anything? That's my beef.

[LJ3]

Wait, there was a black dude in salt lake city? How'd he get in?

[Thumper]

Wait, there was a black dude in salt lake city? How'd he get in?

He is a cop ... they get a pass. ;)

Heck, Eldridge Cleaver (Black Panthers) was a Mormon. :hair

The LDS have temples in West Africa!

[BarryBobPosthole]

Maybe if the group was called "Lives Matter" it would make more sense. Example, have you ever even heard the name Dillon Taylor? If not, why not? He was an unarmed white kid shot by a black cop just last month (Salt Lake City I believe). The way I understand it, he had ear plugs in his ears listening to his iPod or whatever. He matched the description of somebody in the area who was seen "waving a gun around". The kid reached down to turn off his iPod (or pull up his pants, whatever) and was shot dead. Unarmed white kid/black cop! Is it only BLACK lives that matter? If there needs to be a movement to weed out trigger happy cops, what the fuck does color have to do with anything? That's my beef.

So your beef is in the name of the organization? Forgive me. I had no idea the depth of your feelings on this.

Sorry Jim. I'm as upset as anyone about these innocent people trying to their jobs for me and you being targeted. But seriously, have you read anythong about the people doing the killing? they arent gang members or random black people. they're career criminals. Where do career criminals come from?

bKB

[LJ3]

Whether or not blacklivesmatter should be held responsible for anything is very debatable and actual facts vs speculation are very hard to come by.

I think maybe something in the middle that can maybe perhaps if you try a little, be agreed on is that there's lots of people stirring the pot using the #blacklivesmatter hashtag. That's really about the only thing I could pick out of this mess as an actual fact. A weak minded person will respond to pot stirring. Heck,t hey was things are going these days reasonable people will respond to pot stirring. Including myfineself.

I could be wrong.

[Thumper]

Where do career criminals come from? bKB

Prison Universities?

[Captain]

The Huston shooter...
"Miles had a lengthy criminal record going back a decade, but never spent more than short stints in jail."

[Buckrub]

So now career criminals somehow have an excuse?

This is silly. I'm out.

[BarryBobPosthole]

So now career criminals somehow have an excuse?

This is silly. I'm out.

Where in the world did you get the idea this was an excuse?

Bye.

bKB

[LJ3]

Cowboys don't cry and indians don't give a f--k.

[BarryBobPosthole]

Hahaha...no they don't do they?

bKB

[LJ3]

Just keeping you on your toes :)

[Hombre]

The Huston shooter...
"Miles had a lengthy criminal record going back a decade, but never spent more than short stints in jail."

But wait the system is too hard on people

[BarryBobPosthole]

Nobody ever said the system was too hard on people. What I said was our justice system seems to create veteran criminals. i'm not saying we need to mollycoddle ceiminals. But shouldn't we expect better from it? Y'alls buddy Ben Carson says it creates homosexuals fercrissakes.bkB

[Buckrub]

Where in the world did you get the idea this was an excuse?

Bye.

bKB

From your post #45

[Buckrub]

It came to me in a dream (vision?) last night that you might be insane and simply can't think straight. That'd explain it.......gotta be something, eh? :)

[BarryBobPosthole]

Well, I've never denied that part.

I'm not saying there's any excuse. If we're going to do anything but talk to try to fix this issue of the number of career criminals in our cities though, I think we're going to have to have a hard look at at who we're throwing into prisons now and why. i think we're also going to have to look at a different solution for non violent crimes than the same prison we put our hard criminals.

All I'm saying is that there's more to this problem than race. Race issues might or might not trigger these bad guys today but whether they're triggered or not there's still a LOT of bad guys of all races out there and that's the problem. The other is a bullshit symptom.



BKB

[Buckrub]

Well it did just come to me.

I just think you're hiding the real problem. Saying career criminals are a big global problem simply deflects this discussion. Cops are scared. Folks....not career criminals......are rioting in the streets. Cops are being killed, and we're arguing percentages and history. You're trying to justify the validity of a racist hate group, and that part baffles me. I'm betting you are still basing your opinions on your agenda, and that you haven't checked them out fully. We're arguing agendas, not situational issues.

America has some serious problems....and generally obsessed over dumb stuff.

[BarryBobPosthole]

Agendas? Seriously?

no agendas here. And where is there rioting in the streets? And who is committing these murders? Tell me. Is it the rioters?
Do you ever deal in facts?

bKB

[Buckrub]

More than you do it seems.

[Buckrub]

And bringing up career criminals and recidivism is an agenda....and has nothing valid to do with this discussion.

[Buckrub]

And......"where is there rioting in the streets? "???

Seriously? Did you ask that? Ferguson? Baltimore? Wisconsin? Is your tv broke?