"between you and me" is correct.
"between you and me" is correct.
WARNING - Due to the rising costs of ammunition, warning shots will no longer be given.
By the way, when Bush was President, you cared a LOT about Washington. You spent about half your posts here dissing him in some way. You even said you hated him so badly that you'd hate him even if he cured cancer.
So, some oxes get gored on both sides, at times. Or two oxes get gored at once. Or something. But everybody gores Oxen, I guess.
WARNING - Due to the rising costs of ammunition, warning shots will no longer be given.
Interesting analysis:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/politi...y.html?hpid=z1
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro." Raoul Duke
But wait. I thought Obama engineered and caused the shutdown. didn't he print all those signs?
BKB
HAHAHAHAhahaha a Washington Post article, that's fair and impartial reporting NOT
Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner
A Government that pays people to do nothing destorys their willingness to do anything!
Well, we all know news can't be trusted unless the news is from an agency that is bent towards our own political beliefs. Not everyone can be as impartial as Bullshit Mountain.....er FoxNews I mean.
BKB
Not trying to pick a fight here, just a couple observations from an independent. I'd really enjoy hearing whether you guys agree or not.
I think the Tea Party is not only a fringe group but also an insurgent group. By that I mean that they have a clear cut strategy of taking a larger, more important existing party and trying to shoehorn it into the shape of the TP. The trouble is that after a certain point you begin to alienate the more moderate or business friendly wings of the party. There is only so far that you can drag people to the right, after that you start to get backlash or even people leaving the party.
The TP guys I have listened to, and believe me I have done much more reading and paying attention the past month than posting and talking, don't seem to understand that they are not the majority. And further, that purging the GOP of "rinos" ain't going to do anything other than split the party or generate a huge moderate majority that will leave out TP candidates in the general election. The congressional districts have been drawn so crazily that they don't have to worry about this center in the house races but statewide? Nationwide?
Right now I have to say that I consider the TP a hindrance to a healthy long term fiscal plan than a help. Honestly you can draw up a plan in 10 minutes that is fair, balanced, and gets the job done. But that is not what they want. What they want is a drastically reduced federal government, a gashing of the social safety net, and a return to the kind of economic regulation that is akin to what this country had in 1920. In their zeal to not accept anything less they keep the nation from making good, solid steps toward fiscal prudence. All of this talk of deficit cutting is a stalking horse.
Will
Actually BBP, the NEWS part of FoxNews....not particularly the evening shows...is VERY balanced in their reporting. Now, I'll admit the evening shows MIGHT lean a bit to the right, but the NEWS reporting is, as they say, fair & balanced.
Unlike the Clinton News Network, or PMSNBC, or the on-air networks who's "reporting of the news" is so far to the left it is downright comical. Now, that Ed Shultzz....THERE'S a journalist. NOT!
And speaking of news....
Here's a pretty good (IMHO) conservative news site:
http://www.redstate.com/
Niner, I honestly don't watch either one of them on TV. I usually catch the CBS Evening news if I catch national news at all. Mostly I just watch the local news. I do read both the FoxNews website and CNN though and the bias from both is disgusting. I have yet to find an 'objective' web based news site. I tried USA Today but they aren't biased, they just suck.
BKB
If you don't watch Fox News you are getting the news. You are getting a heavy left leaning spin on the news.
Theirs is fair and Balanced. They always have opposing guest and they don't always win argument.
Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner
A Government that pays people to do nothing destorys their willingness to do anything!
From Fox News:
Liberal bias? Fox’s Dana Perino, who was George W. Bush’s spokesman, said, "On balance, if this was a battle, the Democrats definitely won.”
In the hits, runs, and, errors score-keeping that prevails inside the Beltway, this is undoubtedly true. Obama went into this showdown saying he wouldn’t negotiate, and the Ted Cruz wing was determined to defund or delay ObamaCare.
The strategy failed, the president got what he wanted with only a minor concession on the health care law, and the GOP plummeted in the polls.
In purely political terms, Obama is in better shape than he was a month ago, when he was seen as zig-zagging on Syria.
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro." Raoul Duke
This whole episode is disgraceful, whether you're a democrat or republican. There are no winners. (Don't you know this isn't some damned game?)
BKB
Penguin, if the Tea Party is an Insurgent Group because they try to shape a legitimate party into a Fringe Party, then what the heck has happened to the Democrat Party of my youth? Michael Moore, Hollywood Idiots, Pelosi........just totally, TOTALLY, took over the Democrat Party.
Good grief. Be fair.
Besides Taxed Enough Already is pretty dadgum open and honest, as a statement. It's sort of like Pro Life and "Pro Choice". If you get to pick your words and define them, you win every argument. IT should be "Pro Life" and "Anti Life". The folks against the TEA Party clearly want More Taxes. Duh. So say so. Say you love taxes. Say that you love government.
Lunch place downtown has a true, flaming, Bleeding Heart. He says that very thing. He says "I LOVE GOVERNMENT. I LOVE TAXES" and he's laughed out of the building. No one likes taxes. It's a coerced theft made by nefarious thieves to spend on things you'd never spend them on. I know more about how to spend my money than YOU do. Or anyone else. The sheer Ego and Elitism of telling me you can spend my money better than I can!!! So, yeah, if a group wants to stand up and say "We are tired of being taxed this way", I'm for 'em.
But Fringe Group? Go to a meeting, willya? They're just folks.
And Posthole didn't/won't answer me about how he loved talking and thinking about the Government when he was a Minority!!!! And he did. Now he (and all the Liberals) don't like anyone bashing their Hero in any way, cause it might be racist. Gag me.
Going to go sit in a tree for a few days.........and stop thinking of all this.
P.S.
Cappy, I got to admit that ONLY Fox News comes anywhere near close to being fair. But they are not balanced. I have this argument with my buddy at camp, who is addicted to them. It gags me. They are not fair and balanced merely because they invite a Liberal on, then bash them. Yes, they invite them. Yes, they let them speak. Yes, that may seem like it's balanced. But it's not. Balanced would be one hour of Hannity, and THEN one hour of Colmes!!! But they are not doing that, and no one is. Every single outlet is unbalanced.
YES, Fox is the only one that even bothers to invite a speaker from 'the other side'. Yes,that's better. No, none of the others do that. So that's good.
But it ain't Fair and Balanced.
WARNING - Due to the rising costs of ammunition, warning shots will no longer be given.
Will, you're spot on as usual. I saw some polling data of Republicans last week on this. Only about 1/3 of Republicans consider the Tea Party to actually be Republicans as opposed to a separate political party.
Originally Posted by Penguin
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro." Raoul Duke
That's funny. Only 22% of Tea Party members consider the Republican Party to be valid, either.
WARNING - Due to the rising costs of ammunition, warning shots will no longer be given.
Bucky, Obama ain't my hero. But the shit you guys spew is so far off target it ain't even funny. Somebody's gotta be around to keep you straight on stuff.
The things I hated about Bush I hate about Obama as well if you want to know the truth. There's no accountability in government. Ted Cruz won't suffer any consequences at all for costing us $20 billion dollars let alone for the huge waste of time he caused us. the people who crafted the ACA website won't get fired because in government you can fuck up a wet dream and nobody is held accountable. Under Bush, his own advisors outed a CIA agent and there was practically no accountability. The list goes on and on and its true of both of these lame brain presidents we've elected. Can you blame the American people for voting to change the way things were going? and what's the Tea Party mantra? How's that hopey changey thing working out for you? Really? That's their answer? There's no reason for hope or change in our government?
As for the Tea Party, they are a fringe group just like the extreme left is. Right now, Obama isn't controlling his party either as that is where the refusal to negotiate is coming from. Even when the Republicans aren't holding a gun to their own head and shouting "I'm gonna kill the n-----!". My state legislature is as tea party as one can get. About all they've done is act on social issues that are important to the Tea Party. Meanwhile our public education in Oklahoma is going right down the tubes. there is a certain amount of progress that's been made to make the state more palatable to business, but I give our Republican governor most of the credit for that. she's led those fights herself. As a ruling party though, I can't say the Tea Party Republicans in my state have actually made life any better for Oklahomans by getting government out of our lives. We already lived in a state where the government wasn't much inviolved in the first place. About all this state government has done is ensure we won't ever have sharia laws, run off, laid off and totally discouraged a shitload of great schoolteachers, and protected the interests of all of the business related special interest groups in the state, like the liquor distributors, the pharmacies, and doctors who commit malpractice. The one good thing they've done IMO is get Oklahoma off the Federal teat. We don't accept a lot of federal funding for stuff and our state budget is balanced. I gotta hand them that.
I still don't understand why we can't build a decent rest area though.
BKB
Good we're all agreed. Let's kick the tea baggers and the religious right out because I want my Party back.
That's funny. Only 22% of Tea Party members consider the Republican Party to be valid, either.
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro." Raoul Duke
I get it.
But the spin YOU put on it is also wrong.
I showed you, in a documented list, where the House sent the Dem-Senate and Obama proposal after proposal, and they wouldn't consider it. They were the ones that would not negotiate. But from your perspective, you can NOT see that. You have to see it the other way, cause that's the side of the chasm that YOU are standing on. Your side is right.
My comments were to Willy about blaming the Tea Party, and the Tea Party ONLY for being Fringe. If Michael Moore and Dean and Pelosi et al are NOT Fringe, and way more than the common folks that make up the Tea Party, then I'm crazy. They are rich hypocrites that hate me. I don't care for 'em. But to jump up as you both seem to do (but it was HIS thread I was replying to) and blame some folks cause they are TIRED of being taxed, then I get upset. If you want fairness, then BE FAIR for gosh sakes.
And your memory is short too. I lambasted "W" for all his "programs". He had Republican ideology, but he spent like a Democrat.
And just this week I put up a thread lambasting both parties.......because they both spend like wild men. I'm not a Shill. I even used you and Julie as an example of spending (or anyone and his wife). Both can't spend on their pet stuff, cause the bank doesn't care. I did that, but I got no credit from the "Left" around here for that.
I just said Fox News is better than the rest, but NOT BALANCED. I get no credit for that.
The truth is that Ted Cruz and Rush Limbaugh are NOT the Republican Party. But they are the very ones that you use to give examples of why you don't like Republicans. They are FRINGE FOLKS.
But the problem is that Pelosi and Moore and Baldwin and Dean and all are NOT FRINGE Democrats. They represent the majority opinion of most Democrats.
If you truly, honestly, can't see that, then you are fostering an agenda and not having an honest discussion.
WARNING - Due to the rising costs of ammunition, warning shots will no longer be given.
The Tea Party is stuck like a tick to the Republican Party they criticize so much. That's because they wouldn't be a viable party without them. Same reason the extreme left sticks to the Democratic Party. I still say Bill Clinton's strategy of stealing the center from the Republicans is the smoothest trick ever played since LBJ was in national politics. It was the political strategy of the century. and yet, the current Democratic party would no sooner adopt that strategy than they would cut off welfare. It part denial, part stupidity. On both party's parts. the Republican could win the center too if they'd just go after it.
BKB
Hahaha, allow me to offer this: In one way you are completely, 100% correct. In another you are completely missing the boat. At least as far as I see things. Which may be totally out in left field. Or even further off the mark than that.
Yes, the Democratic party has a surplus of truly out of touch liberals. They've had them for years. But what has the accepted and put forward policy of the party been? On social issues alone those folks are truly in power. Mass immigration. Minority friendly employment and education regulations/initiatives. Gender friendly laws on issues regarding so called "women's rights". A barely concealed (pardon the pun) and suppressed (again, pardon the pun) left wing that salivates at the thought of setting aside the 2nd Amendment. I could go on. On social issues they are in power.
But on economic issues? Lock step the party has endorsed practically every so called Free Trade agreement coming down the pike. Their presidents have gleefully went along with banking deregulation (that has resulted catastrophic economic carnage). A good chunk of the party has accepted the right wing's Neoliberal doctrines from top to bottom. There is a name for this changeup on economic issues: The Third Way. Remember that one?
All of which leads me to this: What contingent of democratic party members was left out cold by the combination of these two policy shifts?
Here's a hint: They look a lot like me and they tend to come from backgrounds much like mine. MOF I am probably the only member of my family who could now be considered not one of them. White, middle class, blue collar workers. Remember Reagan Democrats? This is where they came from. They were disillusioned with how the Democratic Party had abandoned labor issues in favor of identity politics... especially when the group singled out to take a hit from those policies was them! This disillusionment and resentment led them away from the party and into the arms of the Republicans. That resentment can still be felt if you talk to them. And without the labor influenced policies of the democrats that acceptance of their resentment is the only consolation that they get from either party. They were abandoned. They've had to accept policies and laws that directly hurt them to stay Republican but the Democrats offer them little or nothing at all except more erosion of whatever has been left to them after the favored minority groups get their turn at the trough. At least as they see it.
But the Third Way was the party's deal with the devil. This is how they managed to get their hands on campaign funds and business backing as private sector labor has shrunk over the decades to a shadow of its former self. They embraced the banking sector as their former biggest backers fade into history.
All of that leads me to this: the Republican Party faces much the same situation now. They are going to have to have their own deal with the devil. They are going to have to toss aside one wing of their party because the TP puts them in a position of having ideologically incompatible wings.
Will
I don't belong to either one of 'em.
I am a charter member of the Fair Party.
So far, it seems to be just me.
WARNING - Due to the rising costs of ammunition, warning shots will no longer be given.
I'm in the Bruton Party of Two Party.
BKB
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